Interview with Belle Waring and Beth Ann Fennelly's Class at Knox College

(18:33) [Nickole Brown] Welcome to the Sarabande in Education's Author Interview Chatroom. Tonight, Beth Ann Fennelly's Modern & Contemporary Poetry Class from Knox College will be interviewing poet Belle Waring.
(18:40) [Belle Waring] Hi Nick, I think I made it. Over
(18:41) [Belle Waring] By the way, the time is different here from what you guys have posted. We have 1855.
(18:43) [Nickole Brown] Hey, Belle! Glad to see you made it. . .
(18:43) [Nickole Brown] Over. . .
(18:43) [Belle Waring] Sorry I did not sign in earlier. Three of the computers here were down and I had to get lucky. Also a little pushy.
(18:44) [Nickole Brown] Yes, it's 6:55 here as well. The time on the server must be wrong.
(18:44) [Belle Waring] So I am getting ready for the conference. What do you guys want me to say? I know the content. How about the tone?
(18:45) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Hello, Nickole and Belle. As my students are logging in, let me tell you a bit about us. Knox College is a small liberal arts college in Galesburg, IL. We have a lot of great poetry students here. In this class we spent two weeks studying Elizabeth Bishop, John Berryman, Anne Sexton, and Sylvia Plath. Then we moved onto Lynn Emaule's book, Then, Suddenly-- and now we're reading yours.
(18:46) [Belle Waring] Glad to meet you. It looks like your students have taken on some heavy hitters. Which one ofLynn Emanuel's books?
(18:47) [Beth Ann Fennelly] The newest one, called Then, Suddenly. We have a pretty lively discussion about it.
(18:48) [Belle Waring] Are your students writers or are they readers or both? What kind of feedback do they need?
(18:49) [Beth Ann Fennelly] They are both. And some darn fine writers if I do say so. But in this class, we're not writing poems--just studying and analyzing and writing papers. They are all pretty much here now, so I'll turn the floor over to Norman for the first question.
(18:51) [Belle Waring] Ready?
(18:51) [Norman] Hi, how are you doing? I had a couple of questions about your collection of poems, but i'll just ask one question right now. I was wondering if you actually witnessed the event you so well expressed in your poem "It Was my First Nursing Job"? And if you didn't, how long did it take for you to do research on the topic?
(18:51) [Belle Waring] Yes.
(18:52) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Could you elaborate?
(18:52) [Belle Waring] Yes, I witnessed the event.
(18:54) [Elaine Farrugia] Hello, Belle! I'd like to thank you for having this chat with us. I noticed that light seems to play a big role in your poetry. I was wondering if you use light intentionally as a tool to convey emotion, tone, etc. or if it ends up happening naturally within the poems?
(18:56) [Belle Waring] Good question. I was banned (as a grad student) from writing about light because it kept coming up in the poems. The image was ge
(18:56) [Belle Waring] Sorry hit the wrong button. Give me a second to regroup and I will type more
(18:58) [Belle Waring] So now I use light both naturally because I am fascinated by it, the way it conveys so much emotive power, so much mystery; becuase it affects tone and mood; because my dad was an artist and I have his eye (I hope); and then, I use it intentionally someti
(18:59) [Nickole Brown] Are you getting cut off, Belle?
(18:59) [Belle Waring] Good question becuse what is a natural leaning, if not an obsession, does not nec. make for a good poem. Sometimes you have to cut your best lines. Do you know this yet? It's very hard to do and yet one must do it. YES NICK I"M only allowed to type about
(19:01) [Belle Waring] Nick it's cutting me off after 3 lines. I can only visualize one line at a time. Sorry I will do my best
(19:01) [Alana Papernik] Hi, I was wondering if you have a background in music, and do you think music plays a part in your poetry?
(19:01) [Nickole Brown] It looks like it will only let you go about 4 lines. This should have been taken care of last time we did our updates, but for now, I guess we'll have to deal. My apologies.
(19:02) [Belle Waring] Good question about music. My mom sang jazz and light classical. She played records (these did exist) and sang all the time. I have her ear(I hope). I think these influences are so deep that they are hard to tease out. I think you yourself (Alana) must ha
(19:02) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Don't worry if it cuts you off--we can wait for two part replies. Thanks, Nickole, for helping us figure out what's going on.
(19:04) [Belle Waring] Alana you yourself must have a good ear to have asked this question. I think when you want to write it really helps to develop your ear. Listen to lots of music. Try to discover what moves you the most deeply. SOmehow it will get into your work. Also read
(19:05) [Belle Waring] ...Read out loud. Never mind what the roomates think. Your cat or dog will appreciate it. Believe me the more you read out loud the more it will pump your own work. Turn the TV off sometimes. It wrecks your ear. It is homogenous and weird and violent. Try
(19:06) [Belle Waring] OK enough lecturing. Next? These are good questions
(19:06) [Alison] I was wondering, who are some poets that have influenced your work, or that you enjoy reading?
(19:09) [Belle Waring] Right now I am reading Ann Carson, autobiography of red; economies of the unlost. I grew up with Shakespeare and the romantic english poets being read to me. I love Frank o"hara, The Last Poets (spoken word group, from the 60s and 70s), Celan, Bishop, Ber
(19:10) [Belle Waring] ...Berryman, Plath, Sexton, James Wright, his son Franz Wright, Lorca, Neruda, Vallejo
(19:10) [Rachel Rucker] Hello, I was wondering about the way your poems deal simply and directly with reality, even if the events in the poem are tragic. Is this a result of your own feelings, because of recent trends in poetry, or both?
(19:11) [Belle Waring] I like Marie Howe's early work, and I love Zbigniew Herbert. Milosz also must be read, his work from the postwar period is essential
(19:11) [Belle Waring] Rachel, give me a minute, good question
(19:12) [Belle Waring] I think it took me a while to know how to deal with tragic events. I worked as a nurse for a number of years and the writing we did there had to go in the patient record at the end of every shift. Here is what the writing was like:
(19:13) [Belle Waring] It was simple, factual, and direct. No opinions. We wrote what we saw, smelled, heard, and did. Not "Patient intoxicated" but "Patient slurring words, ataxic gait, odor of alcohol evident."
(19:15) [Belle Waring] Also, you do not have time to fool around. You have to be kind, but blunt. As for curent trends in poetry, maybe the American tendency to spit things out without preamble is an influence. I would say yes to that.
(19:15) [Belle Waring] But I think there is a question behind your question. Am I right?
(19:17) [Rachel Rucker] Lynn Emanuel said in her poems that she hated emotion and her poems were sort of up front and maybe clipped as a result. So I was wondering if the voice of your poems was because of your views or not.
(19:18) [Belle Waring] Interesting quote from Lynn. I know her and I do not believe she hates emotion. I believe she may hate certain expressions of it. She goes at things sideways. Sometimes she is arch. She is intellectual, from an intellectual family.
(19:20) [Belle Waring] My ambition was to express the deepest feelings most deeply without getting into bathos and without getting boring. But I have a religious temperament. Lynn has a philosophical temperament. You can see how this plays out diffrently in our work.
(19:20) [Laura] Since Alana brought up music a little while ago, I was curious what music you listen to or what music has somehow found its way into your work.
(19:22) [Belle Waring] SHe took me to hear Ella Fitzgerald when I was 8 yrs. old. Ella was the voice of my childhood. ALso tons of classical: Beethoven is my main man
(19:23) [Cynthia] I've noticed that the poetry in Dark Blonde seems to be written in a variety of voices and tones. Do you usually have a specific tone or style in mind first, before choosing subject matter or does the subject of the poem generally dictate its voice?
(19:23) [Belle Waring] Also I grew up with all the great soul music of the 60s. THen blues. I also like rap but not hte ugly stuff. I like what they do with rhyme. I like a capella rap that people do spontaneously. I like freestyle on the subway. I like Latin music.
(19:24) [Belle Waring] Cynthia: good question. one minute
(19:26) [Belle Waring] I am interested in history and how we think about history. Who determines what gets printed: in other words, I am interested in justice. I like dramatic monologs as a way to get to different voices. I use what is called the discovery method of composition
(19:27) [Belle Waring] Discovery method means you have an image and you run with it. Or you hear the poem coming, as Ruth Stone says, "Like a train rumbling from a long way off" and you let yourself freewrite your way into the poem. But sometimes I get hooked on a period in his
(19:29) [Belle Waring] I did some research on the little girls who were aboard the Amistad (never mind that movie) while at the library of congress; I got ahold of eyewitness documents and a Mende Dictionary (a language spoken in Sierra Leone) and I made up a nurse character wh
(19:30) [Belle Waring] a nurse character who was caring for hte kids while they were held in jail awaiting trial. It was a lot of fun but not a very good poem. i am afraid it was overdetermined. I am not sure; I am still struggling with how to deal with this kind of poem.
(19:31) [Belle Waring] Next?
(19:32) [John] Hi Belle, I was wondering about your narrative style. First, I wonder if you have a narrative instinct or do you write this way consciously? Second, have you written any fiction?
(19:33) [Belle Waring] Yes I have written fiction and I continue it. It is extremely difficult. I think I do have a narrative instinct; I come froma family of southerners and spent my first ten years with my grandparents. You know those oldtimers tell stories. You get the way o
(19:35) [Belle Waring] ...You get the way of stories in your blood. I wish I had more of a lyric gift. A truly lyric gift: I would be happy to have this. In fact I have struggled NOT to tell stories in my poems. But the story thing, it gets in your blood. If you look at Harry C
(19:36) [Belle Waring] Harry Crews book, A Childhood: it opens this way: "My first memory was before I was born." Think about this. It's because he grew up hearing stories so vivid he thinks he remembers them. That is the way of my family too.
(19:37) [Claire] How do you mediate between the shocking nature of some of your poetry, while still acheiving layers of meaning beyond the original jolt of the subject matter?
(19:37) [Belle Waring] Do you all have grandparents or oldtime relatives who can tell you stories? This is so very important for writers..
(19:37) [Belle Waring] Next?
(19:38) [Belle Waring] Claire: one minute
(19:39) [Belle Waring] This is a very good question. The short answer is: I show it to somebody and ask them for feedback. Believe me some of those nurse poems are way, way, toned down. This is a good question and I was asking myself the same question today. continued below
(19:40) [Belle Waring] I was reading Carol Ann Duffy's "Adultery" which is vivid and alert like all her work. But I asked myself: so what? continued above
(19:41) [Belle Waring] ...I like the poem, but so what? So what is new about Adultery? The poem conveys the experience. But what else should a poem do? Does it fulfill some cathartic or redemptive purpose? Or does it just get the reader to say wow? Is wow enough? what do you th
(19:43) [Claire] I don't think "wow" is enough. There definitely has to be more, but i'm not sure what the more should be. What do you think?
(19:43) [Belle Waring] What do you think? What else should the poem do? Does it answer an ethical or moral question? Or is the delivery of experience enough? Very basic question. Tough to answer. WHat do you all think?
(19:44) [Elaine Farrugia] I think it needs more than "wow"... it should add something about the subject/experience that might NOT be shared by all readers, something that maybe only that poet could bring to the subject.
(19:45) [Elaine Farrugia] There should at least be some new insight.
(19:45) [Nickole Brown] Just to let you know, we have five minutes left in the chat.
(19:45) [Belle Waring] I have written plenty of stuff that conveyed nothing but angst. I was writing to save meself. But now this is not enough. I am middleaged now and I think about life and death in a different way. In a way alhtough the world is much worse than it was, I hav
(19:46) [Rachel Rucker] I agree, and also if it gets the reader to think about something on their own, then it's good too.
(19:46) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Interesting how age comes into it. . .mary oliver said recently that now she only writes the "necessary" poems.
(19:46) [Elizabeth] I think it has to send the reader away thinking
(19:47) [Belle Waring] I think it is a big world and there is room for a simple, lovely lyric that says, basically, reader, I'm haveing a nice day. And then you need the poem that says, reader, I had a bad day, and here is why: here is the meaning of my history, and the meanin
(19:47) [Belle Waring] I got cut off below> I want to say that although the world is worse than it used to be, paradoxically I have more hope.
(19:48) [Cynthia] Hi. I was wondering if you started poetry-writing before or after you started your nursing career. I myself was pre-med initially (neo-natal actually) and am fasc. by poets like you and Will. Carl. Will. who are involved in both poetry and medicine.
(19:48) [Belle Waring] Are we cut off?
(19:49) [Belle Waring] Nick, my screen has stopped posting input.
(19:49) [Belle Waring] Can you guys hear me? My last visible entry is from Elizabeth.
(19:49) [Nickole Brown] No, I don't think anything is broken. . .
(19:49) [Beth Ann Fennelly] I suppose we're out of time now, but I want to thank you both for visiting with our class. We're about to have some chocolate chip cookies . . wish I could email you both one! Thanks again
(19:49) [Norman] yes
(19:50) [Elaine Farrugia] Yes, we're getting your messages.
(19:50) [Norman] yes, we hear you
(19:50) [Nickole Brown] Thanks, Beth. I hope you all enjoyed yourself. I will be sending everyone transcrripts of this chat shortly.
(19:50) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Great, thanks Nickole, and bye
(19:51) [Belle Waring] I have written since I was a kid. Thank you for your good questions. You were very well prepared and it was a great class.
(19:51) [Norman] no, thank you
(19:51) [Belle Waring] Nick, I just needed to hit the refresh button.
(19:51) [erica] bye! thanks
(19:51) [Beth Ann Fennelly] Speaking with you was our pleasure.
(19:51) [Gayle] bye
(19:51) [Elaine Farrugia] Thank you, this has been helpful!
(19:51) [Norman] Adios!!!
(19:51) [Elizabeth] bye it was nice talking to you
(19:51) [Claire] Thanks, bye.
(19:51) [Amanda] goodbye
(19:51) [Kelsey] good-bye! It was great chatting
(19:51) [Rachel Rucker] Thank you! Good bye.
(19:52) [Cynthia] Goodbye, and thank you
(19:52) [Nickole Brown] Thanks!
(19:53) [Belle] Nick, I think this class was well paced.
(19:53) [Nickole Brown] Yes, this went very well. . .
(19:53) [Belle] ALso, when the screen jammed up, I went back to the link for the discussion area and then came back in again.
(19:54) [Belle] Shall we log out now?
(19:54) [Nickole Brown] Yes, thanks Belle. I'll give you a ring tomorrow.
(19:55) [Belle] OK, I'll be working at home. Morning is best but if not home I will pick up message. Thanks again. You were a big help.
(19:59) [Nickole Brown] Goodbye!